@FritzCat
Sorry for your brother, happy for you, and don’t recommend tobacco myself, just my experience tells me that it isn’t the boogeyman that everyone thinks.
In the hospital once, when born; doctor visits, none, since required physicals.
Would I run a marathon? Nope, but not many my age do.
Still fast, young guys often still ‘play’, trying to learn.
Am I am like when I was 20? Nope.
Roll my own smokes, thanks to the government meddling with the paper, and taxing them into oblivion, but I still don’t recommend them, if you don’t already enjoy them.
The fact is, you’re going to die. Are you going to avoid life, in all of its aspects, just for a year or two more?
I’d rather live in the time I was here, than end up in the same place, never having done so.
@CroutonOllie@FritzCat So to pivot a little bit to a conversation that MAY be best in Poli-ticks – how does one prevent use of a known carcinogen that is also addictive and socially accepted?
Making life decisions would be fantastic in a vacuum, but all choices have implications beyond the immediate. Smoking increases cancer risk – if that’s an outcome someone wants to bear, that immediately impacts them. But those risks are also borne by others who can’t make that choice.
And to go back to FritzCat’s comment – i’ve had cigars a few times and it took DAYS for that taste to go out of my mouth. Dinner tastes like cigars, breakfast the next day tastes of cigars. Not my jam.
@CroutonOllie@radiolysis
Oh, let’s do add politics to the discussion.
My brother spent probably hundreds of thousands of dollars of tax-payer money for his medical expenses and disability payments. And, he’s a good Trump-supporting Religious Conservative. Can you say “bootstraps”? God saved him, not our medical system, taxpayer dollars and Science.
How might we deal with such a medical/social problem?
Tax the hell out of it!
That will even help ameliorate the hypocrisy engendered thereby.
@FritzCat@radiolysis
Eh, in this area I’m free to do as I choose, and don’t much give a damn whether anyone else likes it or not.
I take care of my business, and others should just take care of theirs. I’m not on the public dime, I’m on my own, so if the consequences of my actions come back to deliver a boot to my posterior, then that is understood as a potential part of the equation, just like many other choices we make in life.
@CroutonOllie@radiolysis
I’m all for your freedom of choice as long as you take responsibility and aren’t hypocritical about it.
I’d bet there are real benefits to smoking, as there are for consuming the drug caffeine. Although, I’ve chosen to not experience the benefits of nicotine. Caffeine is one of the drugs discussed in the new book by Michael Pollan. Caffeine is so stimulating that businesses give it to employees for free, and pay them to consume it (coffee breaks). Back in the day, there were smoke breaks too.
@FritzCat
We’re on the same page here, when it comes to freedom of choice and responsibility, and that is the most important part. As to the benefits of smoking, I don’t know of any; it’s just something I enjoy.
I understand how emotionally charged and frustrating it can be, when a loved one makes choices, and then has to face the lousier consequences of the choices they made, but freedoms always bring a risk, and there is always the potential for a set of choices to turn into a mess.
I’m sure that, emotionally, there were equally compelling arguments for the Volstead Act, but we all know how well removing freedom worked in that instance. In short, there are some things you just can’t legislate your way out of, and freedoms should never be surrendered, whether you utilize that particular freedom, yourself, or not; others might.
The road to hell is, indeed, paved with good intentions, and when I examine the few areas in life where I decided to be non-compliant, they always involved the curtailment of freedoms, which I previously enjoyed.
Emotion might be great, as a factor, in any decision making process, but it makes for a lousy determinant.
@CroutonOllie@FritzCat Having watched both my parents die from smoking (lung cancer, COPD). Yeah I prefer to live “avoiding life.” This is not to say I live a safe life, but smoking pleasure vs cost is a no brainer HELL NO for me.
@FritzCat@kls_in_MD
I’m very sorry for your loss, and I’m sure they were great people, that at least had the ability to choose.
I’m not condoning it, but the ability to choose is what makes us different from many others; I may likely end up the same way.
My father smoked, almost died in his mid 30’s, but quit, so I understand where you might wish they had. He’s not here now, but didn’t make it much past where I am.
I enjoy a cigar a few times a year but it’s generally a social aspect, pairing it with some whiskey or scotch on a back patio somewhere. In my slightly younger days I would sometimes sneak a cigarette or two if I was a designated driver and at some type of event because it would give me a very nice buzz that was short lived (unlike alcohol).
Have smoked for almost 60 years, so worry not if you think you’ll die immediately, if you smell it.
You might not like it, your prerogative, but it isn’t like having a whiff of hydrogen cyanide.
One data point…
My brother, 1 year older than myself:
Smoked for 40 years
Me:
Never Smoked…Tobacco
I’ve always attributed it to the health effects of wine…
Also, I will bet that smoking dulls the flavor of wine.
@FritzCat
Sorry for your brother, happy for you, and don’t recommend tobacco myself, just my experience tells me that it isn’t the boogeyman that everyone thinks.
In the hospital once, when born; doctor visits, none, since required physicals.
Would I run a marathon? Nope, but not many my age do.
Still fast, young guys often still ‘play’, trying to learn.
Am I am like when I was 20? Nope.
Roll my own smokes, thanks to the government meddling with the paper, and taxing them into oblivion, but I still don’t recommend them, if you don’t already enjoy them.
The fact is, you’re going to die. Are you going to avoid life, in all of its aspects, just for a year or two more?
I’d rather live in the time I was here, than end up in the same place, never having done so.
@CroutonOllie @FritzCat So to pivot a little bit to a conversation that MAY be best in Poli-ticks – how does one prevent use of a known carcinogen that is also addictive and socially accepted?
Making life decisions would be fantastic in a vacuum, but all choices have implications beyond the immediate. Smoking increases cancer risk – if that’s an outcome someone wants to bear, that immediately impacts them. But those risks are also borne by others who can’t make that choice.
And to go back to FritzCat’s comment – i’ve had cigars a few times and it took DAYS for that taste to go out of my mouth. Dinner tastes like cigars, breakfast the next day tastes of cigars. Not my jam.
@CroutonOllie @radiolysis
Oh, let’s do add politics to the discussion.
My brother spent probably hundreds of thousands of dollars of tax-payer money for his medical expenses and disability payments. And, he’s a good Trump-supporting Religious Conservative. Can you say “bootstraps”? God saved him, not our medical system, taxpayer dollars and Science.
How might we deal with such a medical/social problem?
Tax the hell out of it!
That will even help ameliorate the hypocrisy engendered thereby.
@CroutonOllie @FritzCat It is impossible to pull “politics” away from “public health”. I just didn’t want to club the conversation from the get-go.
@FritzCat @radiolysis
Eh, in this area I’m free to do as I choose, and don’t much give a damn whether anyone else likes it or not.
I take care of my business, and others should just take care of theirs. I’m not on the public dime, I’m on my own, so if the consequences of my actions come back to deliver a boot to my posterior, then that is understood as a potential part of the equation, just like many other choices we make in life.
@CroutonOllie @radiolysis
I’m all for your freedom of choice as long as you take responsibility and aren’t hypocritical about it.
I’d bet there are real benefits to smoking, as there are for consuming the drug caffeine. Although, I’ve chosen to not experience the benefits of nicotine. Caffeine is one of the drugs discussed in the new book by Michael Pollan. Caffeine is so stimulating that businesses give it to employees for free, and pay them to consume it (coffee breaks). Back in the day, there were smoke breaks too.
@FritzCat
We’re on the same page here, when it comes to freedom of choice and responsibility, and that is the most important part. As to the benefits of smoking, I don’t know of any; it’s just something I enjoy.
I understand how emotionally charged and frustrating it can be, when a loved one makes choices, and then has to face the lousier consequences of the choices they made, but freedoms always bring a risk, and there is always the potential for a set of choices to turn into a mess.
I’m sure that, emotionally, there were equally compelling arguments for the Volstead Act, but we all know how well removing freedom worked in that instance. In short, there are some things you just can’t legislate your way out of, and freedoms should never be surrendered, whether you utilize that particular freedom, yourself, or not; others might.
The road to hell is, indeed, paved with good intentions, and when I examine the few areas in life where I decided to be non-compliant, they always involved the curtailment of freedoms, which I previously enjoyed.
Emotion might be great, as a factor, in any decision making process, but it makes for a lousy determinant.
<Edit, for clarity>
@CroutonOllie @FritzCat Having watched both my parents die from smoking (lung cancer, COPD). Yeah I prefer to live “avoiding life.” This is not to say I live a safe life, but smoking pleasure vs cost is a no brainer HELL NO for me.
@FritzCat @kls_in_MD
I’m very sorry for your loss, and I’m sure they were great people, that at least had the ability to choose.
I’m not condoning it, but the ability to choose is what makes us different from many others; I may likely end up the same way.
My father smoked, almost died in his mid 30’s, but quit, so I understand where you might wish they had. He’s not here now, but didn’t make it much past where I am.
It knocks for us all, eventually.
@CroutonOllie @FritzCat Anecdotal though…everyone is different. Some may have serious problems while some have few
@FritzCat @jmruru
I agree, it is variable, as is life.
I enjoy a cigar a few times a year but it’s generally a social aspect, pairing it with some whiskey or scotch on a back patio somewhere. In my slightly younger days I would sometimes sneak a cigarette or two if I was a designated driver and at some type of event because it would give me a very nice buzz that was short lived (unlike alcohol).