I was just pondering…With the lack of “Wine” in the name, perhaps they’ve built in a window of opportunity for bourbon…gin…scotch…rye whiskey…kombucha…hmmm…
I belive liquor licenses are separate from wine licenses. So they would probably need to get different licenses in order to sell any liquor. So unless they were selling out of all their wine, or looking to expand, it probably would not be a good business decision.
scotch? Irish? liquors? absinthes?
There are some awesome small maker liqueurs out there that this would be an awesome opportunity for.
I have some of this ginger spirit that is from Oregon. Where I bought it, at the time, was the only place outside of Portland metro you could get it. (might still be) Its really cool. It is easy to find good mainstream whiskey but some of these artisanal places are down right awsome
And someone in another thread mentioned beer. I don’t like mainstream beer, but some of the really unusual brewers are worth the dime. Can you say dogfishhead.
And many of these places already ship, just people don’t know they exist. When wine.woot first went gourmet, it was some of the sourced products that you actually got from the maker - coffee, chocolate, cheese, that kept me going back and checking until it became an amazon product
@baqui63
not out here, at least not their specialty items.
we have one gastropub that sells one of their higher end reproductions at 20 bucks a bottle.
While spirits would be great, the laws around direct-to-consumer sales of things other than wine are much more restrictive and likely to generate mostly complaints and very little happiness.
Kind of a bummer as I drink a lot more craft cocktails these days and would love to support independant distilleries directly.
As slow as state to state producer recognition has moved it doesn’t seem promising. Best bet for liquor is local delivery through 3-tier retail. Convenience over discount and discovery.
@snapster Yeah… shame, as I’ve been drinking a lot more whiskeys and gins recently.
I’m seriously considering starting a craft distillery since the NY State Class D permit makes it fairly easy with the only hard requirement being for real commercial space which is not cheap here in NYC (no (legal) distilling in my kitchen or basement).
@snapster I’ve bought some good independent (as far as I can tell) stuff from Ezra’s. They’re in Chicago and they ship to California. Not sure where else they can ship.
Re independent distillers: I just learned on The Educational Drinking Show it’s hard even for those in the industry to tell sometimes whether a distiller is independent.
@SSteve I’d love to learn more about the legal angle on that. I’ll start asking more questions. It’s been quite a few years since I listened to someone summarize.
@Pantheist https://www.caskers.com
Sells spirits and whiskeys
Not the cheap stuff
Not everything can ship to every state
"If you go to a bottle’s product page (where you would add it to your cart) and click the “information” tab you’ll see a list of states that it is not available to ship to."
It gives a nice information piece on everything they sell.
Shipping Example
The Glenlivet Nàdurra First Fill Selection Single Malt Scotch Whisky $99.99 for 750ml
AVAILABILITY:
This product is not available in AL, AK, DE, HI, KY, MA, OK, PA, TX or UT.
@Cerridwyn I don’t usually like bourbon or other sweet liquors, but that sippin’ cream does look tempting. I have fond memories of kaluah and milk at my grandparents’ house.
@Cerridwyn I’m not sure about that specific site, but many of the sites that ship wine & liquor into Vermont have a disclaimer in their Terms of Use that basically state that you, the buyer, assume the legal responsibility for following the laws of your State.
@Cerridwyn Took a look at Caskers this evening. They are a NYC based “front end” very much like ww was, in that Caskers does not sell anything, at least not to consumers.
Here in NY State the booze is sold by one of four retail establishments (none being Caskers), all of which appear to be located in NY City. In most other states, the booze is sold by various companies located within that state (again, not by Caskers, which is located in NY).
If you try changing the shipping destination, you’ll find that different states have different things allowed. For example, try Utah: nothing. (Not surprising, since it is illegal in Utah to sell a properly made Martini, among other things, due to the alcohol content of the drink.) Texas is another state that Caskers does not sell to.
I really wish that our country was not so hung up on alcohol and restricting it, but as long as there is lots of money to be made via taxes I don’t expect this to change.
@baqui63 Yeah, what do you expect from the left coast one-party state. Wine? The lobby here is strong enough we have few restrictions for that pleasure.
@rjquillin You don’t even need a lobby. A ton of the state’s economy is wine-based, so they want the producers to be able to sell to all states. So most/all can sell and ship to here.
we would not take up the task lightly. Any way you slice it, beer or the craft hard stuff, will be a very very limited state list for starters. it ain’t easy (to do it legally).
If you look 20 min outside of NYC, in Rockland or Orange County, commercial space can be had for $20 sq. ft. Living in an outer borough, I’ve seen all sorts of commercial real estate turned into “luxury” condos… It’s sad seeing all those jobs being lost…
I’m on the other side of NYC (Flushing Queens) so Rockland is more like 40 minutes outside of NYC without traffic and Orange is beyond that. Getting to the Bronx/Westchester County line from home can be anywhere from 15 to 120 minutes and is usually about 45-60 in my experience (daughter unit 1 went to SUNY Binghamton and @miraclewhispers to SUNY Cortland).
However, your comment also applies to properties in Nassau County, which is where I’m thinking. Suffolk is also too far to schlep.
A coworker has mentioned starting a maker space in Valley Stream and one idea I’ve had is the possibility of offering distilling classes as a way to help fund the real estate cost, tho I’ve not researched whether or not this could be legal in NY State.
@baqui63 I actually live in Little Neck, so I’m not too far from you. . My brother went to school at SUNY Geneseo so I’m very familar with the drive up north. Rents in Nassau are going up, and from what I gather, the renter pays the property the portion of the property tax of their space + rent. When you’re looking for space in Nassau or Suffolk, they don’t add that to the sq. ft. price. In counties that are considered part of the “empire economic zone” you can pay 0% property tax for a number of years. I was planning on moving my business to Rockland county before I landed a full time job and closed up shop. The tax incentives were very intriguing.
I enjoy about 80% of my job and am unlikely to seriously consider moving for a at least 13 years, tho I also say never say never, so anything is possible.
Interesting about the property taxes, tho it might make the taxes deductible for the renter.
Much of this is mere talk on my part for the next two years as I used CC balance transfers to pay child support and tuition thru May of last year. While the average APR is ~2.84%, I have a good bit of debt to retire before I go off and start a business.
From what I recall, wine is different from beer or liquor in that it can be categorized as an “agricultural” product where the seller also grew, fermented/created, and packaged the product. While there are obvious exceptions to that, virtually no one grows & malts their own grain and hops and brews all within their own property. Grain is shipped in. Hops are shipped in. It’s a produced product “assembled” from purchased goods, so it’s not subject to the loophole wine has found to allow reciprocity for interstate shipment.
Anytime I’ve ordered the hard stuff, it’s been somewhat concealed as to what they were shipping and does not even list the place I purchased it from as the return address. My UPS guy commented on my last shipment that he didn’t know what it was but it wasn’t wine and I had to sign for it anyway. I told him it was scotch and he replied not to tell anyone that again because they were not supposed to allow shipments of the hard stuff. So I’m guessing it’s a tricky thing to ship. With that said, there are a few sites out there that get it done.
Aren’t the laws on distilled beverages stricter? If not, I’d definitely be interested in some rye
@Pantheist Yeah, entirely possible…Was just hoping!
@vaaccess @Pantheist I’m just here to snatch up a case of Philips Hue bulbs, what’s all this about beverages?
@Pantheist Rye is good.
@baqui63 aye
@Pantheist Single Malt Scotch?
I belive liquor licenses are separate from wine licenses. So they would probably need to get different licenses in order to sell any liquor. So unless they were selling out of all their wine, or looking to expand, it probably would not be a good business decision.
I dunno but I can wish
scotch? Irish? liquors? absinthes?
There are some awesome small maker liqueurs out there that this would be an awesome opportunity for.
I have some of this ginger spirit that is from Oregon. Where I bought it, at the time, was the only place outside of Portland metro you could get it. (might still be) Its really cool. It is easy to find good mainstream whiskey but some of these artisanal places are down right awsome
And someone in another thread mentioned beer. I don’t like mainstream beer, but some of the really unusual brewers are worth the dime. Can you say dogfishhead.
And many of these places already ship, just people don’t know they exist. When wine.woot first went gourmet, it was some of the sourced products that you actually got from the maker - coffee, chocolate, cheese, that kept me going back and checking until it became an amazon product
@Cerridwyn is Dogfish Head not nationally distributed now? I feel like I’ve seen it everywhere
@jbartus It is in even the low end grocery stores here in NYC.
@baqui63
not out here, at least not their specialty items.
we have one gastropub that sells one of their higher end reproductions at 20 bucks a bottle.
@Cerridwyn If you wana pay for shipping I can send you some.
While spirits would be great, the laws around direct-to-consumer sales of things other than wine are much more restrictive and likely to generate mostly complaints and very little happiness.
@baqui63 correct.
Kind of a bummer as I drink a lot more craft cocktails these days and would love to support independant distilleries directly.
As slow as state to state producer recognition has moved it doesn’t seem promising. Best bet for liquor is local delivery through 3-tier retail. Convenience over discount and discovery.
@snapster Yeah… shame, as I’ve been drinking a lot more whiskeys and gins recently.
I’m seriously considering starting a craft distillery since the NY State Class D permit makes it fairly easy with the only hard requirement being for real commercial space which is not cheap here in NYC (no (legal) distilling in my kitchen or basement).
@snapster I’ve bought some good independent (as far as I can tell) stuff from Ezra’s. They’re in Chicago and they ship to California. Not sure where else they can ship.
Re independent distillers: I just learned on The Educational Drinking Show it’s hard even for those in the industry to tell sometimes whether a distiller is independent.
@SSteve I’d love to learn more about the legal angle on that. I’ll start asking more questions. It’s been quite a few years since I listened to someone summarize.
@baqui63 another area I’m clueless about. I think it’s still pretty tough down here.
@baqui63
I buy from Caskers all the time. It’s not the cheap stuff and afaik it’s shipped from them.
@Cerridwyn It’s new years and I am drunk can you give a quick explanation of what that is to a stranger?
@Pantheist
https://www.caskers.com
Sells spirits and whiskeys
Not the cheap stuff
Not everything can ship to every state
"If you go to a bottle’s product page (where you would add it to your cart) and click the “information” tab you’ll see a list of states that it is not available to ship to."
It gives a nice information piece on everything they sell.
Shipping Example
The Glenlivet Nàdurra First Fill Selection Single Malt Scotch Whisky $99.99 for 750ml
AVAILABILITY:
This product is not available in AL, AK, DE, HI, KY, MA, OK, PA, TX or UT.
And yeah, they work with partners
@Cerridwyn Oh man, I am going to spend way more money than I should here. Thank you.
@Cerridwyn
You just messed with my finances.
Thanks!
(Can’t ship to TX might help with the money a bit. Not with the coveting.)
@f00l
different items, different ship to’s.
don’t know if NOTHING goes to Texas
Almost everything goes to Cali
@Cerridwyn So, 1/2 an hour later, I’ve already decided I need this. https://www.caskers.com/el-espolon-tequila-extra-a-ejo
@Pantheist
Nice
Tequila is not my drink, but I’ve bought some stuff from there that really really I’ll buy again
https://www.caskers.com/spirits/sugarlands-appalachian-sippin-cream-dark-chocolate-coffee-cream-liqueur/
and
https://www.caskers.com/spirits/whiskey/bourbon/prichard-s-double-chocolate-bourbon/
(when it wasn’t sold out)
And some more traditional stuff as well
@Cerridwyn I don’t usually like bourbon or other sweet liquors, but that sippin’ cream does look tempting. I have fond memories of kaluah and milk at my grandparents’ house.
@Pantheist
it’s awesome
it’s so much better than kaluah and milk
@Cerridwyn I thought it might be
@Cerridwyn I’m not sure about that specific site, but many of the sites that ship wine & liquor into Vermont have a disclaimer in their Terms of Use that basically state that you, the buyer, assume the legal responsibility for following the laws of your State.
@Cerridwyn Took a look at Caskers this evening. They are a NYC based “front end” very much like ww was, in that Caskers does not sell anything, at least not to consumers.
Here in NY State the booze is sold by one of four retail establishments (none being Caskers), all of which appear to be located in NY City. In most other states, the booze is sold by various companies located within that state (again, not by Caskers, which is located in NY).
If you try changing the shipping destination, you’ll find that different states have different things allowed. For example, try Utah: nothing. (Not surprising, since it is illegal in Utah to sell a properly made Martini, among other things, due to the alcohol content of the drink.) Texas is another state that Caskers does not sell to.
I really wish that our country was not so hung up on alcohol and restricting it, but as long as there is lots of money to be made via taxes I don’t expect this to change.
@baqui63
nod, i’ve never paid much attention because it is pretty rare you can’t ship to Cali
@Cerridwyn Same for NY.
But a lot of the flyover states between ours have way more restrictions, at least on booze.
If only we could get all the states to treat alcohol and ammo the same way.
@baqui63 no more mail order to CA as of 2018.01.01
@rjquillin For booze? Or ammo? If both, that sucks royally. If just ammo, eh… not surprising.
If they used the same logic for cars, they’d restrict the ablity to buy gasoline to reduce traffic fatalities (which greatly outweigh gun homicides).
@baqui63 Yeah, what do you expect from the left coast one-party state. Wine? The lobby here is strong enough we have few restrictions for that pleasure.
@baqui63 damned straight
oh, can’t be either, but yeah
@rjquillin You don’t even need a lobby. A ton of the state’s economy is wine-based, so they want the producers to be able to sell to all states. So most/all can sell and ship to here.
Perhaps the distilled products should be offered over at caskmates.com.
we would not take up the task lightly. Any way you slice it, beer or the craft hard stuff, will be a very very limited state list for starters. it ain’t easy (to do it legally).
@Winedavid49 You can do it!
@Winedavid49 A CA-only sale for some delicious whisky would be fine for some of us
@Winedavid49
Drooling
@Winedavid49 What was the distillery we tried to hook up with on the last tour? Really wish we would have made that happen.
If you look 20 min outside of NYC, in Rockland or Orange County, commercial space can be had for $20 sq. ft. Living in an outer borough, I’ve seen all sorts of commercial real estate turned into “luxury” condos… It’s sad seeing all those jobs being lost…
@rjaiswal
I’m on the other side of NYC (Flushing Queens) so Rockland is more like 40 minutes outside of NYC without traffic and Orange is beyond that. Getting to the Bronx/Westchester County line from home can be anywhere from 15 to 120 minutes and is usually about 45-60 in my experience (daughter unit 1 went to SUNY Binghamton and @miraclewhispers to SUNY Cortland).
However, your comment also applies to properties in Nassau County, which is where I’m thinking. Suffolk is also too far to schlep.
A coworker has mentioned starting a maker space in Valley Stream and one idea I’ve had is the possibility of offering distilling classes as a way to help fund the real estate cost, tho I’ve not researched whether or not this could be legal in NY State.
@baqui63 I actually live in Little Neck, so I’m not too far from you.
. My brother went to school at SUNY Geneseo so I’m very familar with the drive up north. Rents in Nassau are going up, and from what I gather, the renter pays the property the portion of the property tax of their space + rent. When you’re looking for space in Nassau or Suffolk, they don’t add that to the sq. ft. price. In counties that are considered part of the “empire economic zone” you can pay 0% property tax for a number of years. I was planning on moving my business to Rockland county before I landed a full time job and closed up shop. The tax incentives were very intriguing.
@rjaiswal Ha! Potential casemates then.
I enjoy about 80% of my job and am unlikely to seriously consider moving for a at least 13 years, tho I also say never say never, so anything is possible.
Interesting about the property taxes, tho it might make the taxes deductible for the renter.
Much of this is mere talk on my part for the next two years as I used CC balance transfers to pay child support and tuition thru May of last year. While the average APR is ~2.84%, I have a good bit of debt to retire before I go off and start a business.
From what I recall, wine is different from beer or liquor in that it can be categorized as an “agricultural” product where the seller also grew, fermented/created, and packaged the product. While there are obvious exceptions to that, virtually no one grows & malts their own grain and hops and brews all within their own property. Grain is shipped in. Hops are shipped in. It’s a produced product “assembled” from purchased goods, so it’s not subject to the loophole wine has found to allow reciprocity for interstate shipment.
@corrado
I remember reading somewhere: there was an English quip during WWII:
“England survives on her Hips and her Hops”
Hips: rose hips
Hops: brewing
(I believe this remark saluted/jested about the nutrient content.)
Anytime I’ve ordered the hard stuff, it’s been somewhat concealed as to what they were shipping and does not even list the place I purchased it from as the return address. My UPS guy commented on my last shipment that he didn’t know what it was but it wasn’t wine and I had to sign for it anyway. I told him it was scotch and he replied not to tell anyone that again because they were not supposed to allow shipments of the hard stuff. So I’m guessing it’s a tricky thing to ship. With that said, there are a few sites out there that get it done.